Annalouiza 
Yes, welcome, welcome. On today's episode, we're looking forward to our conversation with Libby Carr. Libby has been an environmental and political activist for much of her life. It was when she had her first big job working for the Sierra Club that she had her near -death experience while on the Whitewater raft trip on the Snake River. This happened in 1972 and several years before much had been written about this phenomenon. She lives in Songaia co -housing an intentional community in the Seattle area. Welcome Libby.

Libby Carr 
Hey, thank you very much. Thank you. Yeah.

Wakil 
Great to have you here. Thanks for coming and being willing to tell your stories. So we always like to start with the question of when you first became aware of death.

Libby Carr 
Well, other than the usual ways of growing up and having relatives, you know, along the way die, but my parents were still with me, nobody really close to me. So I guess my first real conscious awareness was my near-death experience in 1972 that I shared an essay with you about it that I was finally able to write after 50 years later of wanting to tell that story. it was, I was certainly for many, years just could not find words to feel like I was adequately expressing what I experienced. And that's one of the things that many people who've had a near -death experience say is that there are no words to really describe it.

Wakil 
Yeah, yeah, I've read that and I've read some books that talk about the different things people have gone through. It seems to be, as you said at that point in 1972, there really wasn't much being said about it. now there are now there are whole books written about it and it's very fascinating.

Libby Carr 
Right, right, which has been so wonderful to see. Raymond Moody, who's the psychiatrist who wrote Life After Life and the book we're all referring to, was published in 1975. So for three years there, I was really in a conundrum because for several years prior to that, I had worked at McLean Hospital on the admissions ward, which is the country's oldest private psychiatric hospital. And while I was working there, I took a course through the Harvard Extension program in psychology. So I was very well steeped in traditional Freudian psychology. And I was the psych aide who had the keys where we locked people up for hearing voices.

Wakil 
wow.

Annalouiza 
Wow.

Libby Carr 
So I was very reticent to talk about my experience for fear of being labeled as crazy. And I knew firsthand what that looked like, but from the other side of the key.

Wakil 
Sure.

Wakil 
Right. Yeah.

Libby Carr 
Yeah.

Annalouiza 
So tell us how this death experience has impacted the rest of this life that you've led and how you have managed to finally have the words to write what you wrote.

Wakil 
Yeah, maybe tell us the story if you want.

Libby Carr 
Yeah, I was sent a course on spiritual direction about a year and a half ago. And the first writing assignment was to describe the spiritual touchstones of your life that have led to your current spiritual belief or outlook. And for some reason, that was finally the right question for me to write about my near -death experience. And then the other two much shorter pieces of writing after the first one is the second one is about the my mother who had died two weeks earlier paid me a visit and we had a conversation. And then a number of years later, I had a very vivid dream two years in a row about my angel asking me about how do the reindeer fly? And that's the real story on how that whole thing got started. So all three of these events, and especially, of course, the first one with my near-death experience under the raft, have very much informed my spiritual outlook at this point in my life.

Wakil 
Would like to tell us more about that story? About how that happened? What happened?

Libby Carr 
You mean the near -death experience and how that affected my spiritual outlook?

Wakil 
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, the story itself. I mean, we read we were both able to read your essay, but I think it'd be nice to share with the audience.

Libby Carr 
Sure. Sure. Well, the basic thing that happened was I, this is soon after I graduated from college at the University of Oregon in Eugene, where I grew up.

I had a job lined up working for the Sierra Club. So I came up and my job was to help Brock Evans, who was the Northwest rep at the time. And he had a float trip he was supposed to go on with members of the Army Corps of Engineers who wanted to put a dam on the last section of the Snake River and the conservationists didn't want that dam placed.

So we hired an outfitter and had three large pontoon rafts of people in this party who had come to see the canyon. And the night before we all gathered up and had a potluck dinner and had a good time and got to know each other and the guy who was, there were three congressmen and their staffs on this trip because the bill was in front of their committee. And so they saw this as a great opportunity to come out to see if this canyon was worth saving or not.

Wakil 
Hmm.

Wakil 
Wow.

Libby Carr 
So that was sort of the scene that was set. And I was representing the Northwest office of the Sierra club.

But when I got there and looked at the canyon, it was obvious that the canyon could speak for itself. If it needed to. And just to relax and have a good time and not worry about lobbying anybody. So, and the head who was, the guy who was head of the delegation was this man in his, I'd say mid 80s, who is still recovering from oral surgery and James Key from West Virginia, who is known as the king of strip mining. So he was politically pretty opposite from the position that I was in, of course.

And we started out the next day and there were probably 50 of us and we were divided into the three rafts and I decided to sit in the bow of the boat where I could get the best view and these were huge pontoon rafts that were like 25 feet long and had a large rubber ring around it that was about three feet in diameter.

And these had been turned into very large floating rafts that the guides use these long oars to go through the rapids to navigate the river. And we were embarking upon the white water and got in the middle of it and our oarsman lost control, I guess, and the bow of the boat just fell into this enormous

Annalouiza 
hole. Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr 
...hole of water, just this big. And with the nose down first, which is where I was sitting. And we, so all of a sudden I was upside, the raft was on top of me.

And we all had on these enormous life jackets with the old iron hooks that I couldn't get out of my life jacket. And all of a sudden, I realized I'm out of cut out of I'm pinned underneath this raft. And I tried pushing against the buoyancy of my vest to get away from the raft, but that wasn't possible.

And I try and try and try. And finally I'm running out of air and energy to continue. And I remembered saying to myself, well, Libby, I guess this is it. Sort of saying goodbye to myself because I knew I was, I was spent. There was nothing left to work with and there was no one around to help me.

And I just started drowning and taking water into my lungs and started losing consciousness. And then what I was aware of was all of a sudden I don't think I really heard a voice like an audible, but a question was clearly planted in my consciousness, which was, Libby, are you ready?

Wakil  
Hmm.

Libby Carr  
It was, that was the question. And with that question, I was like infused with all this knowledge all at once that if I chose to accept this invitation, I would be just fine. In fact, I would be better off than I was here on this planet. 

Wakil  
Hmm. Hmm.

Libby Carr  
And I started thinking I had never had this information before and I start thinking, wow, what an invitation and it's gonna be really incredible. 

Wakil  
Hehehe.

Wakil  
Hmm.

Annalouiza  
Mm

Wakil  
Hmm.

Libby Carr  
I just was given all this knowledge that I would be just fine, that there was nothing to fear and I would be A -okay. And it's kinda like I started thinking and looking between, well, should I go or should I stay? And I said, I am younger than I expected. I thought I would live to be older than 24, but maybe not. And I start weighing the choice. And all of a sudden, another question is put in front of me, which is, Libby, what's your answer? We don't have all day here.

Wakil  
Hahaha!

Annalouiza  
Hehehehehe

Wakil  
Wow.

Libby Carr  
So I was prodded very clearly to answer the question. And I remember feeling like, well, OK, I guess I could go. It looks pretty good over there. And I started to say yes. And all of sudden, the answer came out, no, I can't go. I haven't finished.

Annalouiza  
Hmm.

Libby Carr  
And when I gave that answer, it was as if God or whatever that energy is infused into my body on a molecular level, the energy and also the will to try again to push against the raft and to get out. So I tried again and I got out.

Annalouiza  
Wow.

Wakil  
Mm.

Libby Carr  
I got out and away from the raft. And I think by that time we had gotten through the boiling, roiling water and we're down into slack water. So I didn't have, wasn't, you know, it was more possible. 

But I had given an, had used, the will wasn't there, but all of a sudden I got both energy and the will to try again and I popped out from underneath. 

Wakil  
Wow.

Libby Carr  
So that's what happened. And then I just relaxed and floated over to the side and was coughing and sputtering. And all of a sudden there was all these young Army Corps of Engineer guys who had gone out to look for my body, because they had gathered down river and counted noses and reassembled and realized I was missing.

So they took me back to where the others were gathered and the old guy from West Virginia literally jumped for joy.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Libby Carr  
I remember being so taken by, oh that's what jumping for joy looks like.

Wakil  
Wow.

Annalouiza  
haha

Libby Carr  
Because nobody had ever been that glad to see me. And what I realized, what I realized was that I reminded him of his granddaughter and he also reminded me of my grandfather. So this transference thing was going on. And so we just sat and enjoyed each other's company and we were all very happy to be alive after that. 

Wakil  
Wow.

Annalouiza  
Wow.

Libby Carr
And then they went back to Washington DC and passed the canyon into wilderness. Signed the bill and passed it into wilderness. Yeah.

Wakil  
Wonderful. Wow. Yeah, the Snake River is still on the list of places they want to remove dams from to get even more wild again. that was like one of the first steps.

Libby Carr  
Right. So this was a dam they didn't have to remove because it never got built.

Wakil  
Right? Hallelujah.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm. That's beautiful. Wow, what an amazing journey.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah.

Libby Carr  
Yeah. Yeah.

Annalouiza  
You know, and I'm curious, like when you came to meet with the rest of the folks, did you have that in your mind? Like I, I about died just now. Or did anybody say that to you?

Libby Carr  
Oh I knew that I had just about bought the farm by drowning. Oh yeah, I knew that. But I couldn't articulate or talk about this. Well, really for several weeks and then I saw my parents, think I gone to visit them in Eugene. I saw my parents and I told them about it.

And they both believed me. I knew that they believed me, but they both said to me, if I were you, I wouldn't talk about this very much. 

Annalouiza  
Hmm.

Wakil  
Interesting.

Wakil  
Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr  
It sounds preposterous. But I knew they believed me, but I couldn't talk about it. shouldn't talk about it. So which is all part of and plus my background of having worked in the psych hospital. 

So every day for about a whole year, I'd go for a walk in the morning and I'd have this debate with myself of, well, you just had a little tiny temporary psychotic break. 

Wakil  
Okay.

Annalouiza  
wow.

Libby Carr  
After all, you were in a hard space. You were between a rock and a hard place. It's not unusual to have a little psychotic break when there's too much stress. And then I'd argue the other side. And I said to myself, every time when I finally was getting back home, I'd say, okay, just tell the truth, what happened? And every time it came up that I heard the voice of God.

Wakil  
Yeah.

Libby Carr  
I never could talk myself into saying I had a psychotic break because I didn't think I had. I had something else. I had a conversation, an interchange with an energy that was beyond anything I had ever experienced.

Wakil  
Hmm.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Wakil  
Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Wakil  
Sure.

Libby Carr  
But it was very real. It was the truth. So, after asking myself for about a year that same question and having that debate and driving myself crazy, I finally said, just shut up and live your life. You know, stop having a conversation with yourself. And then a year or so later when I read Moody's book, Life After Life, which is about a hundred interviews of his interviewing and drawing conclusions of about a hundred people, all of whom had had near -death experience and became the first scientifically done, researched writing in the modern era. I mean, there's writings about NDE's in the Bible and other places from many other documents, but this was in terms of the popular literature in the present day. So that's, I just bawled like a baby all the way through that book, 

Wakil  
Wow.

All right.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr
...because I finally found my tribe and some confirmation that I had not had a psychotic break and that I had experienced something and that I wasn't crazy.

Wakil  
Yeah, wow, that's so important. Yeah.

Annalouiza  
That is powerful. It is important. Yes. Because once there's a community and language emerges to define and share this experience, it's the collective benefits from this, right? So I'm so glad you read that book and you have your story and you're not psychotic.

Wakil  
Yeah, right.

Libby Carr  
Yeah, yeah. So then I, the people who wrote that book, not around that period of time or not long afterwards, started forming an organization called the International Association for Near Death Studies, IANDS.

And the first chapter of that group was in Seattle. And I had happened to heard one day an interview on the radio with the woman who was head of it. So I tracked the group down and started going to their meetings, which were monthly. And for people who had had a near death experience where they would come and tell their story as well as for anybody interested in hearing about this. So that's, I've attended their meetings now for 35, 40 years and they're still going. 

Wakil  
Wow, yeah.

Libby Carr  
So naturally I've came to hear a lot of people's and two of the people in that group, neither of whom had had a near death experience, but they were very interested in the subject. He was oncologist and she was an attorney. So they ended up starting a website called enderf .org, N -D -E -R -F is their website. And they started asking for people to write in and to write their stories. So they now have like 8,000 stories on their website in 12 plus languages from all over the world.

Wakil  
Wow.

Hmm. Wonderful. Yeah, we'll put that in our notes, our podcast notes as well. So great. Thank you. Well, tell me a little more about how does this affect your life now? How does it affect what you do or what you're how you look at life, maybe?

Libby Carr  
Well, the biggest thing it did for me was it removed my fear of the other side. And I had grown up, when this happened to me, I was questioning whether or not there was a God and, you know, my religious background, which was Presbyterian at the time.

And I, came to see religion per se as which flavor ice cream do you want? You know, you want chocolate or vanilla or strawberry, and Episcopalian, a Baptist, a Congregationalist, whatever. And that that was okay to be in a particular denomination, but that wasn't the real conversation. The real conversation is what happened what I was engaged in underneath the raft. 

Wakil  
Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr  
And that that was that had all of a sudden become a very personal experience. And so I became much more interested in that conversation of with whatever that entity was, because that's where I would be headed. 

Wakil  
Yeah.

Libby Carr  
That was where I was going. In fact, that's where we're all going. And that all I knew was it was going to be fabulous. And without having to worry about earning a living or paying taxes or, you know, a lot of the negative aspects here. But it was. And the other thing I, you know, it took me years to think about this and to articulate it. One of the other things I became aware of was that it's a matter of it's it's analogous to school.

Annalouiza  
learning.

Libby Carr  
...that you have to come back over and over to this life until you have a certain level of proficiency in the lessons of to love, to grow, and to forgive.

Wakil  
yeah.

Libby Carr  
And that you get to come back here and do it again until you have a certain level of proficiency in those areas. And then you can graduate and you're going somewhere else.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. 

Wakil  
Nice, yeah.

Libby Carr  
So that was another major issue.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Libby, I just had a thought though. You know, not everybody has a near death experience 

Libby Carr  
Right?

Annalouiza  
and don't have this kind of like clarity about what we're doing. Why do think that is? What brings some of us to those moments that it shifts us so completely? And to many others, it's like, I don't understand what you're saying. you know, death is feared. The other side, you know, I mean, it just occurred to me what changes for some of us.

Libby Carr  
Well, think this is all my intuitive interpretation. First of all, the writings going on these days, the research going on these days, I've heard a number of places, about 17 % of deaths that occur are from people who describe having had a near -death experience.

So obviously those people perhaps quote unquote died by all outward signs, but they came back and they lived to tell their story. So this implies that a lot of other people didn't die, they stayed gone. 

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr  
They stayed on the other side. So your question is why do some people have NDEs and others don't appear to?

Wakil  
Or maybe have that awareness. I think maybe that's the other part of his game, somehow gain that awareness of what you what you gained from the NDE that it's I love your word. It's fabulous. It's going to be fabulous. You know? Yeah.

Annalouiza  
And also, I'm so sorry to interrupt. was just going to say like, Wakil, you're right. it, 17 % of folks have said, yes, it was a near death experience. And there are other ways to get to this kind of clarity again, this view of the other side, because I'm going to say I had a very similar experience, but not through near death, it was through a dream. And I too heard that voice and said, are you ready?

And in that moment, I remember thinking, yes, I am. And then there's another part of me, this is when my children were really young. in my thoughts, I said, but who's gonna tell the stories? The stories are gonna disappear if I go right now. And then I said, no, I can't go yet. And it was like, whew, and it was completely like, my dream is done, right? But I had this exact sense that you did. It's like, yeah, it's fabulous.
I would so love to go. But I had I have work to do. So maybe

Libby Carr  
And that's called a lucid dream and there's been research on that of a lot of people having experiences be it a dream or some sort of moment of heightened lucidity that where they have that a similar conversation so I absolutely have heard and believe that it doesn't take having to actually...

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Libby Carr  
... have a flatline experience, know, these experiences can happen in other situations. What I think was super important is to pay attention to those experiences and not to write them off or not to discount them, but to go over that experience again and again and again, which is what my whole life has been about is you know, thinking and analyzing and reliving and remembering that experience as you have done with that dream.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Wakil  
I think the good message to our audience is that is what you're saying is that don't discount. Don't think it's a psychotic episode if you have a kind of if you have an experience like that, really value it and learn from it 

Annalouiza  
Hahaha.

Libby Carr  
Yeah, it's a gift.

Libby Carr  
Right.

Wakil  
And and learn from other people, learn from other people who have had these experiences and share them. Whether even if you haven't had it yourself, this is a way to understand, you know, what is that mystery that we're heading towards? And as you said, Libby, we're all going there. And it's going to be fabulous.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Libby Carr  
Right? So the value of this for everybody, both people who've had this experience and those who have not but want to learn about it, is that when that day, when you get closer to that day of exiting yourself, you are much better prepared. It's not nearly as scary and terrifying and something to be fought and resisted. You know, it's a doorway that you get to walk through and to look forward to.

Annalouiza  
Yeah. It's almost like you've been going past this door and just touching it and saying, I'll go through it soon. That's not a problem. I actually mentioned that to my kids just maybe like a week ago because I just recently started practicing letting go because there's a part of me that says, know, people constrict at the time of death. Not everybody, not all the time.

But I was thinking if I were ever in a car accident, how frightening that would be. Right. And rather than like constricting and like, like I don't like, I don't, have no idea. I've never had anything happen to me, but in my mind, as I'm walking some days, I'm like, if I hear that metal crushing, if I'm feeling constricted, just like open up and just let go. Right. And my daughter was like, you're crazy lady. Like, what are you doing? I was like, but we don't know. And I'd rather practice letting go than showing up to that portal and not knowing what to do. Right? Like.

Wakil  
Yeah. It's muscle memory kind of worked in a way to just kind of run that by and think about it and go through it and consider. Yeah. And you're right. Who knows if we'll be able to actually pull that off in the moment.

Libby Carr  
Yeah.

Annalouiza  
It's kind of fun to think about though.

Libby Carr  
Yeah. So I want to say something that you alluded to, Annalouiza, was so when I was in that conversation under the raft, Libby, are you ready? And I started to say, yes, I want to go. And then comes out of my mouth, no, I can't go. haven't finished yet. That's what puzzled me the most is why did I say that? That wasn't the answer I was going to say. And it took me several years and I realized that was my daughter speaking who needed me to be her mother, which is what happened eight years later.

Wakil  
Wow. Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Yeah, I just got goosebumps. I believe that, yeah.

Libby Carr 
Yeah. So, that was. Molly needed me as her mother vehicle and that's what happened. And so I think that if you've taken care of your business and then that day starts to come 

Annalouiza  
approach.

Libby Carr 
... at whatever age, then it's, to me, it's the awareness of taking care of business all along the way. So when you finally do face it, you've got no regrets and you don't have to fight it.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah.

Libby Carr  
You have to reset you in fact can welcome it. It's a day of joy.

Annalouiza  
Well, I love that too. And also, you know, there's a, there's some written documentation of Buddhist monks who have proclaimed that they are ready to go and they will go and they literally die. 

Libby Carr  
Right.

Annalouiza  
And you know, I, that's the same thing. I, I wonder if they've been doing the practice, they've been doing their work, they've been taking care of business and they have that sensation because they've been standing at that portal, you know, making sure it's there. I'm here. Like I like this Libby. I like this conversation quite a bit. It's a great reminder. I gotta keep touching that portal. I gotta write down the stories because that was the whole point of me sticking around.

Wakil  
Yeah. Exactly. Right. Well, and I like I think we talked a little earlier before the recording of the the book that you wrote, Libby, and that you said, really, the point of mentioning that is that it's one of those things that you you needed to get done. You know, it's just recognizing the things that you want to do. Don't don't put off those things, those stories like you're saying on, Annalouiza.

Libby Carr  
Yeah.

Wakil  
Get those stories written. Take care of those things because, know, we don't know. It's as Bodhi says, you know, we're all going to die. We don't know when. But that mystery is. But being in that space of acceptance of the mystery, acceptance of whatever it might be, is really a beautiful reminder for all of us. So great, Libby. This has been a really great conversation. Really appreciate you coming on and talking to us about this. Is there anything else you wish we had asked you?

Libby Carr  
Thank you.

One of the things that I can do now that I've spent a lot of time remembering and working on this experience and integrating it into my life is I'm happy to talk with people who are terminally ill or their family members and share my story, share my experience.

So like, my mother died and she died a few days after she had broken her leg and gotten a compound fracture that they couldn't set because she was recovering from lung cancer and chemo and radiation and the doctors knew they couldn't put her under because she'd never come out of the anesthesia.

So I asked her when I saw her in the hospital and she had been a medical technologist for 35 years in Sacred Heart, the hospital she was in at that point in her life in Eugene. And I got down there and finally got rid of everybody visiting her and giving her a pep talk that somehow they were gonna find a way to take care of this situation.

I made them all leave.

Wakil  
Ha

Libby Carr  
And I said, mom, do you understand what's happened? And she said, yes, I understand. And I said, well then, what do you want to do? And nobody had asked her that question.

Wakil  
Right. wow, that's important. Yeah.

Libby Carr  
What do you want? And she said, you know, I really think it'd be easiest and best for everyone if I just left. 

Wakil  
Mmm. Yeah.
Wow.

Libby Carr  
And I said, well, mom, that's okay. Daddy will be fine. I'll be fine. That's okay with me. And then she says, will you tell me again what happened to you underneath that raft? 

Wakil  
Wow.

Libby Carr  
So I tell her and I'd say six, eight hours later she died, she left. 

Wakil  
Well...
Yeah.

Libby Carr
And it was wonderful. It was beautiful. And that's what we often do is we often want someone to not die because that's what we need. That's what we think we need. We don't ask them, what do they need? What do they want?

Wakil  
Exactly.

Right. Such an important lesson. We've been talking a lot about that particular lesson lately about, you know, what are we, what are we, what are the words we're saying to people and the visiting we're doing or the, is it for us or is it for them? And have we even checked in to see what they want or need? 

Annalouiza  
Yes, Libby. that's such a great gift. that's another one of my little pieces of my mission statement for being in this meat packet in this time and place is like the stories I tell are both vehicles or gifts or they're just to nurture another soul on its journey. Right. And that's what you did with your mom. You shared that story and that story was the medicine. That story was the portal. That story was the gift. And you know, there's more people who would really benefit from your story as they will be listening to it here. Thank you so much.

Wakil  
Yeah. Yeah.

Libby Carr  
Well, it took me a long time to process this whole experience. And part of that was, what are people going to think? Are they going to think I was crazy? Because I was hearing a voice and they don't believe me. And finally, when I was able to let go of that, I don't care whether or not, it's not my business whether or not you believe me.

Wakil  
Right? Yeah.

Libby Carr  
I was then able to own my story as my experience that did not require anybody else to believe it.

Annalouiza  
Right. Yeah.

Wakil  
I love that. So important, yeah.

Libby Carr  
that was not, that's not my business. And so I share that essay when I feel that someone might be interested in hearing it for whatever reason. And so that's how it comes up. And I'm very grateful I was able to let go of my ego as to whether or not someone's going to believe me or not. I don't give a shit, you know, that's not my business.

Wakil  
Right, yeah. Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Right. And so, you know, this is one of my favorite Hazrat Inayat Khan's pieces, right? Everybody to their own evolution. Like just because you're feeling this and knowing this doesn't mean that everybody will come along and say yes to this story. But it doesn't matter because you could share from the goodness of your soul and being and it lands where it lands and it doesn't where it doesn't and you just keep moving on and that's a gift for you. That's your work.

Libby Carr  
Right.

Wakil  
Yeah. Amen. Thank you. Very, very good. Well, I really appreciated this. We're kind of out of time, but I appreciate the conversation and looking forward to hearing people's responses. And we'll put podcast notes about all the different things you mentioned. And you provided us with a lovely poem from Paul Carr, who is your ex-husband, right? Is that correct? Yeah. It's called the door. Yeah. So maybe do you want to take turns reading? Like, I'll start and you can do the next one on Louisa. Do to do it that way? OK. So.

Libby Carr  
Right, right, and a great poet.

Annalouiza  
Yeah, sure. Libby, do you want to join in on the poem reading or do you just want to? OK.

Libby Carr  
No, I just want to listen. Thank you.

Wakil  
Okay. All right. It's called The Door by Paul S. Carr III.

The bone is brittle, slight and weak. It's covered, it's, I'm sorry, I'm to start over because we can edit that. The bone is brittle, slight and weak. It's covered, parched and thin. The lines, a broken spiderweb of veins along her skin. She spends a final effort that her fingers find once more. The one who she has ever loved, he stands beyond the door.

Annalouiza  
She gathers strength, a wisp of air, to make him hurry in. But nothing's left to carry sound, and no way to begin to tell him that all she has found so lately in her life, of how each day she loved him so, through sickness, toil, and strife.

Wakil  
Her fingers claw upon the bed. Cannot he see her pain? He must come to her swiftly now before that ghostly train, whose wailing whistles she can hear, an empty, minor chord, rolls into this dimension to take her soul on board.

Annalouiza  
And yet, he stands there waiting. No closer does he come. Transfixed beyond her reaching hand, as if there were, as if there must be some impenetrable barrier, some force that holds him back. Her breath is quickly fading now. Her muscles going slack.

Wakil  
Why will he not just come to me? she thinks with her last breath. And then her chest will rise no more, and she accepts her death. But where she thought to fade to black, there suddenly is light. The daybreak of her consciousness has banished mortal night.

Annalouiza  
For he had been the one who left, had lain upon the bed, and died to live on in her mind, and in her heart and head, and now his hand is out to her, though he had gone before, for he has waited all these years to help her through the door.

Annalouiza  
Wow. Yeah.

Wakil  
Wow, beautiful.

Annalouiza  
You okay, Libby?

Libby Carr  
Yeah.

Yeah, it's pretty, pretty intense.

Wakil  
Yeah, beautiful. Beautiful.

Annalouiza  
Thank you for sharing this beautiful missive from your ex -husband.

Wakil  
Thank you to Paul for allowing us to publish it.

Libby Carr  
Right. Yeah. It's best work, in my opinion.

Annalouiza  
Mm -hmm.

Wakil  
Wow. Well, thank you again. We really appreciate you and all that you do and your sharing. And we'll be in touch.